Having, like you, learning nothing from my GCSEs I was then forced to do another one, “to fill in the gaps in my A level timetable.” I picked a GCSE in British Constitution, I learned, to my surprise, that there were no meaningful constitutional checks on the power of the UK Prime Minister. That was in 1977. Two years later Thatcher came to power and put my theory into practice.
As an English teacher, I like to think that I encourage thought and discussion beyond the curriculum. How successfully is for my students to decide, I suppose. But, ultimately, it's impossible, and professionally destructive, to pull away from the core material. It is entirety true that rhetoric and performance, as you articulate it, should absolutely be part of that core. It's so deleterious that it isn't. We are currently undergoing a curriculum review - let's hope it's given the weight it deserves but I shan't hold my breath.
Yesterday I saw a story about a lady in Gateshead who'd been to night school classes to resit her GCSE Maths and got herself a pass, 39 years after her third failed O Level attempt as a teenager. Good luck to her.
In the intervening years she'd completed both a Batchelor's and a Masters and enjoyed a successful paediatric nursing career. A true societal contribution.
I too failed three times in the mid 80's, two Us and an E, it's warped into something of a sense of ironic pride that I've managed to have a decent career in IT without ever passing my Maths O Level. It's also amused friends.
At the risk of sounding a bit "Jeremy Clarkson", is passing it really worth all the pressure. If you're shit at Maths accept it, it doesn't necessarily make you innumerate or thick, and there's no joy in being forced to resit it over and again.
Education should be something that you look forward to, not resent.
Nowadays you need maths and english GCSE to get into sixth form, at least in my area. ridiculous stumbling block though I do believe in being able to spell and add up
I think this is what I meant, that you can get by without Maths and English quals. I like to see good spelling and grammar but that’s just me. I’m lucky as I have a husband with a calculator-cum-map for a brain. He can carry stuff and open cans too.
That's quite true… My two sons had to pass both GCSEs at our local Academy in order to join its Sixth Form, but our neighbours, who opted for private education, found that after all that expense, their boy was refused admission to the Sixth Form after failing Maths.
So restrictive. If you can’t do that stuff it must be hard to get qualifications in the arts. My sister in law is a music teacher in despair because of that, and the cuts to music education in general …
The issue isn’t whether one can get by day-to-day in adult life. The issue is that a qualification in maths and English allows teenagers to accesss higher and further education.
The stepping stone qualification will open opportunities, particularly to students who have a good pass in one subject but experience particular difficulties in the other.
I don't want to sound like a total snob, but getting a 4 in Maths and English isn't hard. It's somewhat easier than getting a C at O-level was. That much is clear from the pass rates.
To require that pediatric nurses, electricians or anyone else with responsibilities for the heath and safety of others is able to understand the language and do arithmetic really isn't the social injustice you seem to think.
but they are effectively barred from other roles too like teaching art or music. Anyway it is paediatrics not pediatrics. #justsaying. We are in UK not USA. Sorry to be an old bigot.
Northern Universities Joint Matriculation Board had two versions of O Level, basically Mathematics and an easier version which was mainly arithmetic, I can’t remember its official title. In my all girls school most students sat the easier exam, a small group who were specialising in sciences, took Mathematics and had extra lessons after school.
The proposed ‘stepping stone’ exam seems like a good idea, it is a pragmatic solution to a current problem. NVQ courses at Level 3 and above required passes in GCSE English and maths. This acts a barrier to some courses which don’t need this level of proficiency in one or other subject.
The new qualification could open up opportunities for students on appropriate courses.
You mean CSE s Don’t know what happened to them or how useful they were. I did JMB too. In my area CSEs were for the cleverer people in secondary moderns. They took the 13 plus too. To ‘give them a second chance’ I hated that system I am getting triggered thinking about it
This is very true and very funny. I am old enough to have done O Levels. The revision was indeed the first time I started doing any work. BORING. My tactic was to do no work for subjects I didn't like and that got me enough passes. My daughter also used this tactic but went one step further by not even turning up for some exams. I did not advise her on any of this. It must have been genetic. And yes, sixth form and university were fun. (for both of us as it turned out)
"Everyone dies, everything ends, you are born alone and will die alone, there is no natural justice, life is arbitrary, rewards are not distributed fairly, the fundamental conflicts of the human condition are insolvable, all propositions are vulnerable to doubt."
You think Reform voters have doubt as a central part of their intellectual worldview?? In my experience they're the most certain people I've met. The least curious, the least reflective and the least prone to doubt anything (especially themselves, but also what they read, see or hear)
I was passed all my exams because I had neat handwriting and a good memory for facts and figures. That was all that was bring tested. I hadn't the faintest comprehension of the underlying meaning of those facts and figures. The only subjects I've used throughout my working life are Maths... and Latin which has been perennially useful in all kinds of unexpected ways, from gardening to learning Spanish. My degree? Never used it.
My take on education: everyone leaves school at 16, goes out into the world, gets a manual job and learns about life. If they like they can come back into education at the age of 25 or so when they know what they want to learn more about. Repeat ad infinitum. The time for a Masters or a PhD is when you're middle aged.
My youngest (GCSE results yesterday) has just skim read this Ian, and enjoyed it. Although being a 16 year old his favourite bit was how you despatch with the reader at the end of course.
One aspect in the decline of humanties in the universities is that students appear to have forgotten how to think for themselves. The whole part of schooling is now about passing examinations - even at A-Level, so the schools get good ratings and the kids are supposedly more employable. It's really back to Victorian schooling and learning in rote. I'm a very mature PhD student and my supervisor is always complaining that she has to spend time encouraging first year undergrads to work things out for themselves rather than be spoonfed everything. Was it the same when I went to Uni first time around in 1975? I like to believe things were better then. But I suspect my lecturers were still grumbling about the intellectural weaknesses of their students. Anyway at least we didn't have the AI - the ulitmate prop for the lazy student.
The whole "education thing" came way too early for me. That it was an essential step towards having any sort of "success" in later life, completely passed me by. And I was both shocked and relieved, when the school suggested it would be wasting everyone's time by going back next year.
I don't know why I was shocked. My brother and I competed for worst attendance record in the history of the school. He won - but I got the "most detentions in a single term" award! In my defence, I was a farmer's lad - and if my dad needed a hand, we were first pick. The fact that we were "free", probably had something to do with that.
As an educator of 35 years, and currently Principal of a sixth form college of over 2,500 students, I'd love to read this out at the start of term. I probably won't, and I'll just say well done on your GCSEs and now let's focus on A Levels. However, I agree totally, and this is one of the most honest takes on education I have read in a long time.
A fascinating read. I think that is probably how the system was meant to work.
Unfortunately - for me - my school (girls' grammar 1970s) thought I was doing fine at a sort of B+ level. And I knew what I wanted to do at uni (ha, ha - no I didn't). So no one bothered to tell me about revision at all - I had a friend who 'did' it, and there were lessons on the timetable marked 'revision', but no one attempted to explain the concept to me at all. I passed my GCSEs, unremarkably, on the basis of a good memory and reading the dates of the Crimean War before school on the day of the History exam - which selected my essay question in advance.
In the lower 6th my biology teacher - horrified at a drop in my grades - suggested I make a habit of re-reading the previous week's material before a test. Mind blowing.
If my current work or personal life ever has moments of stress I guarantee it will manifest in my the relived nightmare of taking my gcse maths exam - this is because it was one of the worst experiences of my life. I revised and studied like hell, I was glued to the bbc bitsize series could smash a maths paper at home, I could sail through a mock paper but in an exam setting I would disintegrate, on the day of my exam I had a terrifying panic attack so severe I projectile vomited over my exam desk which was the final humiliation that lead my bully of 2 years to physically and brutally beat me as opposed to mentally from year 8. I came out of my GCSE's with 11 A* including A* in Chemistry unbelievably but no friends and, afraid to say 3 suicide failed attempts it was the lowest time but I came out of it all emotionally stronger and a true lover of academia especially critical analysis and debate. The irony is of course my GCSE's count for nothing on paper, they are as about as relevant as the ox blood leather bound record of achievement book we were told was a life bible -all utter bollocks (if you know you know) but that period and that fear broke and remade me, I changed in every sense, I embraced my truth I understood that I loved to learn and I did not care what anyone thought about it anymore. Reading was my escape comics, books, journals whatever I could get my hands on - after that everything got so much better thank goodness. I will be there for my son during his exams when they come and I will never underestimate the grueling fear that they superficially hold. Thanks for sharing.
Having, like you, learning nothing from my GCSEs I was then forced to do another one, “to fill in the gaps in my A level timetable.” I picked a GCSE in British Constitution, I learned, to my surprise, that there were no meaningful constitutional checks on the power of the UK Prime Minister. That was in 1977. Two years later Thatcher came to power and put my theory into practice.
As an English teacher, I like to think that I encourage thought and discussion beyond the curriculum. How successfully is for my students to decide, I suppose. But, ultimately, it's impossible, and professionally destructive, to pull away from the core material. It is entirety true that rhetoric and performance, as you articulate it, should absolutely be part of that core. It's so deleterious that it isn't. We are currently undergoing a curriculum review - let's hope it's given the weight it deserves but I shan't hold my breath.
Every year I get further away from being 14-16 is a year of solid improvement in my life
Amen to that, my friend.
Fascinatingly ideas, beautifully expressed, and from a compassionate place. Lovely to read.
I tell any kid who will listen, yeah it's important but there's lifelong learning on the other side which is far more interesting and meaningful.
Yesterday I saw a story about a lady in Gateshead who'd been to night school classes to resit her GCSE Maths and got herself a pass, 39 years after her third failed O Level attempt as a teenager. Good luck to her.
In the intervening years she'd completed both a Batchelor's and a Masters and enjoyed a successful paediatric nursing career. A true societal contribution.
I too failed three times in the mid 80's, two Us and an E, it's warped into something of a sense of ironic pride that I've managed to have a decent career in IT without ever passing my Maths O Level. It's also amused friends.
At the risk of sounding a bit "Jeremy Clarkson", is passing it really worth all the pressure. If you're shit at Maths accept it, it doesn't necessarily make you innumerate or thick, and there's no joy in being forced to resit it over and again.
Education should be something that you look forward to, not resent.
Nowadays you need maths and english GCSE to get into sixth form, at least in my area. ridiculous stumbling block though I do believe in being able to spell and add up
The inabilty to spell correctly has nothing to do with intelligence, it’s a consequence of a neurological condition called dyslexia.
Mental arithmetic isn’t tested in GCSE Maths.
Both skills are almost redundant in the modern world. although they can be useful.
I think this is what I meant, that you can get by without Maths and English quals. I like to see good spelling and grammar but that’s just me. I’m lucky as I have a husband with a calculator-cum-map for a brain. He can carry stuff and open cans too.
The issu
That's quite true… My two sons had to pass both GCSEs at our local Academy in order to join its Sixth Form, but our neighbours, who opted for private education, found that after all that expense, their boy was refused admission to the Sixth Form after failing Maths.
The system seems so rigid nowadays.
So restrictive. If you can’t do that stuff it must be hard to get qualifications in the arts. My sister in law is a music teacher in despair because of that, and the cuts to music education in general …
I can add up perfectly well. Well enough to manage budgets certainly.
What I couldn't do was sines, cosines, trigonometry and other stuff like that
The issue isn’t whether one can get by day-to-day in adult life. The issue is that a qualification in maths and English allows teenagers to accesss higher and further education.
The stepping stone qualification will open opportunities, particularly to students who have a good pass in one subject but experience particular difficulties in the other.
I don't want to sound like a total snob, but getting a 4 in Maths and English isn't hard. It's somewhat easier than getting a C at O-level was. That much is clear from the pass rates.
To require that pediatric nurses, electricians or anyone else with responsibilities for the heath and safety of others is able to understand the language and do arithmetic really isn't the social injustice you seem to think.
but they are effectively barred from other roles too like teaching art or music. Anyway it is paediatrics not pediatrics. #justsaying. We are in UK not USA. Sorry to be an old bigot.
We are, but auto-correct isn't
I can set mine to British English , have a look round but sorry to preach
Go for it. Preaching is an underrated skill.
Northern Universities Joint Matriculation Board had two versions of O Level, basically Mathematics and an easier version which was mainly arithmetic, I can’t remember its official title. In my all girls school most students sat the easier exam, a small group who were specialising in sciences, took Mathematics and had extra lessons after school.
The proposed ‘stepping stone’ exam seems like a good idea, it is a pragmatic solution to a current problem. NVQ courses at Level 3 and above required passes in GCSE English and maths. This acts a barrier to some courses which don’t need this level of proficiency in one or other subject.
The new qualification could open up opportunities for students on appropriate courses.
I hope so
You mean CSE s Don’t know what happened to them or how useful they were. I did JMB too. In my area CSEs were for the cleverer people in secondary moderns. They took the 13 plus too. To ‘give them a second chance’ I hated that system I am getting triggered thinking about it
I don’t mean CSEs which were not offered at my Grammar School.
Maths and arithmetic are not the same thing.
Arithmetic is just a subset, and probably one that most people are least likely to struggle with.
I've added up loads of stuff in my IT career, never had to work out the cosine of a parallel tangential plane....
You'd get a 4 then, which is all you need to remain in education. Trigonometry isn't even in the foundation GCSE paper
Trigonometry is included in GCSE Foundation Maths.
https://share.google/iOBCg8RD2NeEJAK8r
I very much apologise! Clearly accuracy was a paper I failed.
I have to say I am no good on detail and that is bad too
"basic right-angled trigonometry (sine, cosine, and tangent) is covered on the GCSE Maths Foundation paper"
...at least James would be spared parallel tangential planes (unless they're at right angles)
I didn’t understand them and managed to scrape a grade 6 in Maths. All I used it for was calcualting drug doses for my patients, aka adding up
That photo description is absolutely brilliant! :-)
This is very true and very funny. I am old enough to have done O Levels. The revision was indeed the first time I started doing any work. BORING. My tactic was to do no work for subjects I didn't like and that got me enough passes. My daughter also used this tactic but went one step further by not even turning up for some exams. I did not advise her on any of this. It must have been genetic. And yes, sixth form and university were fun. (for both of us as it turned out)
"Everyone dies, everything ends, you are born alone and will die alone, there is no natural justice, life is arbitrary, rewards are not distributed fairly, the fundamental conflicts of the human condition are insolvable, all propositions are vulnerable to doubt."
You sound like a Reform voter 🤣
You think Reform voters have doubt as a central part of their intellectual worldview?? In my experience they're the most certain people I've met. The least curious, the least reflective and the least prone to doubt anything (especially themselves, but also what they read, see or hear)
No, but Ian's paragraph is what I imagine they say to themselves at night
I was passed all my exams because I had neat handwriting and a good memory for facts and figures. That was all that was bring tested. I hadn't the faintest comprehension of the underlying meaning of those facts and figures. The only subjects I've used throughout my working life are Maths... and Latin which has been perennially useful in all kinds of unexpected ways, from gardening to learning Spanish. My degree? Never used it.
My take on education: everyone leaves school at 16, goes out into the world, gets a manual job and learns about life. If they like they can come back into education at the age of 25 or so when they know what they want to learn more about. Repeat ad infinitum. The time for a Masters or a PhD is when you're middle aged.
My youngest (GCSE results yesterday) has just skim read this Ian, and enjoyed it. Although being a 16 year old his favourite bit was how you despatch with the reader at the end of course.
One aspect in the decline of humanties in the universities is that students appear to have forgotten how to think for themselves. The whole part of schooling is now about passing examinations - even at A-Level, so the schools get good ratings and the kids are supposedly more employable. It's really back to Victorian schooling and learning in rote. I'm a very mature PhD student and my supervisor is always complaining that she has to spend time encouraging first year undergrads to work things out for themselves rather than be spoonfed everything. Was it the same when I went to Uni first time around in 1975? I like to believe things were better then. But I suspect my lecturers were still grumbling about the intellectural weaknesses of their students. Anyway at least we didn't have the AI - the ulitmate prop for the lazy student.
The whole "education thing" came way too early for me. That it was an essential step towards having any sort of "success" in later life, completely passed me by. And I was both shocked and relieved, when the school suggested it would be wasting everyone's time by going back next year.
I don't know why I was shocked. My brother and I competed for worst attendance record in the history of the school. He won - but I got the "most detentions in a single term" award! In my defence, I was a farmer's lad - and if my dad needed a hand, we were first pick. The fact that we were "free", probably had something to do with that.
As an educator of 35 years, and currently Principal of a sixth form college of over 2,500 students, I'd love to read this out at the start of term. I probably won't, and I'll just say well done on your GCSEs and now let's focus on A Levels. However, I agree totally, and this is one of the most honest takes on education I have read in a long time.
"I probably won't" - for shame ...
A fascinating read. I think that is probably how the system was meant to work.
Unfortunately - for me - my school (girls' grammar 1970s) thought I was doing fine at a sort of B+ level. And I knew what I wanted to do at uni (ha, ha - no I didn't). So no one bothered to tell me about revision at all - I had a friend who 'did' it, and there were lessons on the timetable marked 'revision', but no one attempted to explain the concept to me at all. I passed my GCSEs, unremarkably, on the basis of a good memory and reading the dates of the Crimean War before school on the day of the History exam - which selected my essay question in advance.
In the lower 6th my biology teacher - horrified at a drop in my grades - suggested I make a habit of re-reading the previous week's material before a test. Mind blowing.
If my current work or personal life ever has moments of stress I guarantee it will manifest in my the relived nightmare of taking my gcse maths exam - this is because it was one of the worst experiences of my life. I revised and studied like hell, I was glued to the bbc bitsize series could smash a maths paper at home, I could sail through a mock paper but in an exam setting I would disintegrate, on the day of my exam I had a terrifying panic attack so severe I projectile vomited over my exam desk which was the final humiliation that lead my bully of 2 years to physically and brutally beat me as opposed to mentally from year 8. I came out of my GCSE's with 11 A* including A* in Chemistry unbelievably but no friends and, afraid to say 3 suicide failed attempts it was the lowest time but I came out of it all emotionally stronger and a true lover of academia especially critical analysis and debate. The irony is of course my GCSE's count for nothing on paper, they are as about as relevant as the ox blood leather bound record of achievement book we were told was a life bible -all utter bollocks (if you know you know) but that period and that fear broke and remade me, I changed in every sense, I embraced my truth I understood that I loved to learn and I did not care what anyone thought about it anymore. Reading was my escape comics, books, journals whatever I could get my hands on - after that everything got so much better thank goodness. I will be there for my son during his exams when they come and I will never underestimate the grueling fear that they superficially hold. Thanks for sharing.